SUV vs Pickup offroad

"youshiftem" (torinosport302) 01/20/2016 at 11:47 • Filed to: None

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Front page post got me thinking; I use my diesel F350 to get wood from deep into the woods on old logging roads. I figured this would be a good choice since it has decent ground clearance, four wheel drive and a e-locker rear end. However, whenever “offroad” vehicles are spoken about you rarely hear about someone using a pickup, usually it’s jeeps, land rovers, and other closed in vehicles. Would one of those vehicles handle the trails better? What makes them better?

BorkBorkBjork > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 11:54

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I have found that, especially in mud, my Tahoe fares better than my friends pickup trucks. I would chock that up to weight distribution being more even across an SUVs wheelbase as opposed to a pickup truck with an empty bed.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 11:54

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Often the body design lends itself to having a little more rear wheel weight compared to the total, and that can matter. That, and if it’s designed from the ground up as an offroader, you can see things like the engine set further back in the frame, optimization for articulation, and a short enough wheelbase to avoid high centering and enhance manueverability.

All those things don’t add up to the difference between competence and its lack, and really only matter on the far end of things, but there are differences between a purpose built and “a truck”. I would never trust the squarebody Suburban we have to get some of the places my Rover can, just because of its weight, balance, size, etc. etc. - but it does okay on a trail.

sm70- why not Duesenberg? > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 11:54

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I have noticed that. My thought would be that the stiff springs many HD trucks have for payloads and towing aren’t so great for serious trails. But TBH I don’t get why either.

Party-vi > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 11:58

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Trucks exist to haul stuff and provide a market for JC Whitney grille inserts. Jeeps exist to go off road. Land Rovers exist to go off road after the lease is up and it’s on the 3rd owner.

I don’t think anything makes an SUV better than a truck for off road duty, but I do think trucks being sold for the purpose of hauling shit is what keeps them out of the minds of people when they think about off road vehicles.

forgeryfade > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 11:59

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Breakover angle. Longer vehicles can be lifted and made more capable but the breakover angle usually still stops most obstacle aspersions. That and trucks usually have long rear overhang.

E30Joe drives a Subaru > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 12:00

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Wheelbase is part of it. But some trucks are great offroad (Tacoma).

jjhats > Party-vi 01/20/2016 at 12:04

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The Tacoma is aimed squarely at the offroad market not the occasional truck guy market. very different strategy from what chevy is doing to the Colorado. trucks can and are as good if not better than suvs for offroading. adventuring maybe not but offroading yes

Luc - The Acadian Oppo > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 12:06

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A short wheel based vehicle ala Jeep Wrangler ect would be infinitely better if we are talking bone stock.

The break over angle of the truck you posted even with a 6" lift would still be worst than a stock 2dr wrangler.

A truck is just too long to be useful in “real” off road situations. They only thing that might work would be a lifted regular cab short box.

Scott > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 12:07

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The main issue with trucks, are the long wheel base. You can get high centered more easily, and you have less maneuverability. The Shorter the wheel base the less likely it will be an issue. That said, it all depends on where you are going and what kind of trail your on. I tend to see trucks all the time, because most people in my area need the cargo space of the truck, and can’t afford a dedicated off road vehicle, as well most everything does not require that amount of a specific vehicle. I do know people how have SUV’s set up especially for off-road driving, but unless your really are going onto truly difficult trails you won't see many such rigs.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 01/20/2016 at 12:08

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The Rover would tiptoe, the Burban would bash anything in its way. Same thing with my Silverado (which has seen dirt roads before)

It’s a subtle difference in theories of offroading.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 01/20/2016 at 12:09

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Anywhere with soft ground, the Burb has the habit of trying to either nest or wallow in it. Too much lolweight.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 01/20/2016 at 12:10

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It doesn’t got through mud, it wants to stop and bash it into submission.

Example:

youshiftem > Scott 01/20/2016 at 12:12

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Ah, I didn’t consider this. The trails I’m on are fairly flat with long sweeping hills making traction on mud and snow the main obstacle. I can see how the short wheelbase would come in handy in other situations.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 01/20/2016 at 12:13

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...and possibly eat it. Yeah, I think that checks out.

BigBlock440 > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 12:16

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Size mainly. The length of the truck and rear overhang mean it’s got poor breakover and departure angles. Trucks are mostly fine, unless you’re doing any tight stuff.

Scott > sm70- why not Duesenberg? 01/20/2016 at 12:19

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That’s because generally you want a suspension that will follow the contours of the trail or keep good contact. HD trucks tend to be for hauling heavy loads, or pulling heavy trailers. This means a very stiff suspension, that will not flex well. Also it means the Chassis and everything else is beefier and if you get into soft ground your more likely to sink in rather than stay on top.

I had that issue when my truck (a half ton dodge) got stuck in some snow on a mountain top in late June. A guy in a 1-Ton Chevy came along and tried to pull me out. Instead his truck sunk into the dirt and cause the trail to give way underneath him. Nothing to due with his make of truck, just the extra weight of a one ton truck. Ended up calling a friend in an off-road club to come pull us both out. My truck got out with just a small crack on a running board, but pulling the Chevy out of the dirt the 1-ton Chevy broke the steering rod, and got a puncture in the lower cooling hose. We managed to jury-rig the steering to get him back to pavement, but the cooling hose required a run to some steams to get water, and regular stops to cool down.

Party-vi > jjhats 01/20/2016 at 12:21

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I would disagree that trucks are better than SUVs for offroading, mostly because Ford doesn’t sell a truck with a front locker to my knowledge yet Jeep does.

I would say that body-on-frame vehicles are better suited to off roading, and that most body-on-frame vehicles happen to be trucks.

For Sweden > Party-vi 01/20/2016 at 12:36

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Jeeps exist for bumper stickers

Party-vi > For Sweden 01/20/2016 at 12:38

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And Yamaha made the best Volvo engines. Grrl quit being salty.

For Sweden > Party-vi 01/20/2016 at 12:40

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Cars that came with straight six engines after Jeep moved to V6:

Volvo

Somethin' 'bout a truck > Party-vi 01/20/2016 at 12:44

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Trucks exist to haul stuff and provide a market for JC Whitney grille inserts.

I hate how true this is..

911e46z06 > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 12:50

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I don’t think it matters much in terms of performance. There are some small differences. Pickups are better in sand because they tend to be lighter than similarly-sized SUVs.

Pickups are more popular as ranch/farm trucks because you tend to load them up with shit you don’t want inside. SUVs are more popular with your average off-roader because you need to bring gear with you, and you would rather have your gear sitting inside than getting wet, or muddy, or baked by the sun, or flopping out of the truck bed.

BloodlessWeevil > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 12:57

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Wheelbase and overhangs mostly. I assume you are familiar with approach, departure, and breakover angles? Guys who offroad trucks try to start with short wheelbase versions and usually swap out the bumpers.

Party-vi > For Sweden 01/20/2016 at 13:10

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*Jimmies rustled for not listing BMW*

The frumious Bandersnatch! > youshiftem 01/20/2016 at 17:10

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“ I use my diesel F350 to get wood”

A perfect explanation for why men buy diesel 350s.

youshiftem > The frumious Bandersnatch! 01/21/2016 at 08:08

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Just one of the many perks of owning one.